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Community Paying It Forward
- Thread starter Vitolo
- Start date
Vitolo
Vaporist
They do.... in cola, root beer, purple passion and many more.
If you meant colas, like in nice big buds, they don't because they are now working in bulk, and do not want to be less than frugal with or be forced to give consideration to:
- storage Space
- end weight
I thought I would never lose my hair.
I had thick full hair my entire life, and as I became older, it became coarser, and more thick than in my youth.
A year ago I turned 69... and within a month of that birthday I started to notice a growing thin spot at my crown.
What they call male pattern baldness.
It now is a concern.
I have ego tied up in my physical appearance.
Hair was always important to me.
so as I prepare to be 70 I am taking Finasteride. They call it also Propecia.
Coincidence is that at the same time.. my prostate started to be enlarged!
Same pill for both issues!
Same causation:
An observational Study of the Association between Androgenetic Alopecia and Size of the Prostate
I can have a new modern prostate surgery... and I will be asleep since I have spasticity
(they can't risk me jerking while inside of me)
I am waiting to be called... but I will still keep taking the Finasteride...
..in hopes that my hair loss will at least slow to a halt... and perhaps start regrowth.
Sorry to become long winded.
The answer to what you just asked.... 70
For me at least act 70 hair became an issue.
Because "they" are assholes!
ataxian
In a BLACK HOLE!
I’m much younger 62 ( Still a kid in my day dreams)They do.... in cola, root beer, purple passion and many more.
If you meant colas, like in nice big buds, they don't because they are now working in bulk, and do not want to be less than frugal with or be forced to give consideration to:
- storage Space
- end weight
I thought I would never lose my hair.
I had thick full hair my entire life, and as I became older, it became coarser, and more thick than in my youth.
A year ago I turned 69... and within a month of that birthday I started to notice a growing thin spot at my crown.
What they call male pattern baldness.
It now is a concern.
I have ego tied up in my physical appearance.
Hair was always important to me.
so as I prepare to be 70 I am taking Finasteride. They call it also Propecia.
Coincidence is that at the same time.. my prostate started to be enlarged!
Same pill for both issues!
Same causation:
An observational Study of the Association between Androgenetic Alopecia and Size of the Prostate
I can have a new modern prostate surgery... and I will be asleep since I have spasticity
(they can't risk me jerking while inside of me)
I am waiting to be called... but I will still keep taking the Finasteride...
..in hopes that my hair loss will at least slow to a halt... and perhaps start regrowth.
Sorry to become long winded.
The answer to what you just asked.... 70
For me at least act 70 hair became an issue.
Because "they" are assholes!
My dad is 80 and strong beyond standard human’s?
He has gray full hair!
Me and my younger brother have a bit of frost. (He surf’s every morning before joining the rat race?
I mostly study subject’s (goofing off and kind of dazed growing up like Dennis the Men-is!
My surf friend’s in High School said MAUI had long COLAS. This guitar player called Hendricks played 4 us long haired blondes hippie surfer’s. (We must of funded our life style somehow, job’s were rare so work did not fit?)
Last edited:
Vitolo
Vaporist
I want to send my thanks to @Bologna
That was a very kind thing that you did, when you sent that package!
What can't be used by one can be re-homed easily with a patient.
The grinders will help out right away... and thanks for the other tools that you were able to
send rather than discard! They will come in very handy indeed!
That was a very kind thing that you did, when you sent that package!
What can't be used by one can be re-homed easily with a patient.
The grinders will help out right away... and thanks for the other tools that you were able to
send rather than discard! They will come in very handy indeed!
Vitolo
Vaporist
I guess it will be no surprise to you all, that I have received a couple of donations of newer, state of the art Vaporizers.
Yes. The Tafée Bowle is among them.
The Bowle is a unit that I racked my brain thinking about, and figuring where they would do the most good.
I met a patient that is one of the sweetest and most beautiful young women I have known.
Hardship brings the best out in people often.
I see her tomorrow about a Tafée Bowle.
The first Tafée Bowle Recipient!
Still active around home, except on her weaker, sicker days.
She is wonderful, beautiful.... and all alone.
Her parents are deceased.
Seriously ill with Hodgkin's Lymphoma, she is only 28...
..and has been deserted by her husband.
Prick started cheating on her during her hospitalization.
He was home cheating in their marital bed.
Made me cry.
Crying right now.
He left her because she found out she can't have kids.
His telling her he was leaving was before her diagnosis.
She was diagnosed before he left, in fact he stayed for a few more months and watched her get ill.
She weighs under 100 pounds.
He left her empty handed, and she is now on Medicaid and other govt. programs.
A licensed certified teacher that won't be able to work again.
Her husband took her computer and she is too sick to want to fight for her possessions.
The husband watched his own wife puke without sympathy and left without remorse.
I hate him for this.
My wishes for him have left me confused and troubled, as I am not familiar with this level of dismissive behavior...
.. and I am not accustomed to feeling this level of disappointment in my fellow man.
This is where that 1st Tafée Bowle is going.
I think this is a beautiful place for it to land.
I bought her a 1/8 ounce of G13 to go with it.
I would gladly give up my own food for this fragile girl that is way too sick... way too soon.
I look forward to my appointment tomorrow.
I just wish my eyes would stop leaking and dry up.
Yes. The Tafée Bowle is among them.
The Bowle is a unit that I racked my brain thinking about, and figuring where they would do the most good.
I met a patient that is one of the sweetest and most beautiful young women I have known.
Hardship brings the best out in people often.
I see her tomorrow about a Tafée Bowle.
The first Tafée Bowle Recipient!
Still active around home, except on her weaker, sicker days.
She is wonderful, beautiful.... and all alone.
Her parents are deceased.
Seriously ill with Hodgkin's Lymphoma, she is only 28...
..and has been deserted by her husband.
Prick started cheating on her during her hospitalization.
He was home cheating in their marital bed.
Made me cry.
Crying right now.
He left her because she found out she can't have kids.
His telling her he was leaving was before her diagnosis.
She was diagnosed before he left, in fact he stayed for a few more months and watched her get ill.
She weighs under 100 pounds.
He left her empty handed, and she is now on Medicaid and other govt. programs.
A licensed certified teacher that won't be able to work again.
Her husband took her computer and she is too sick to want to fight for her possessions.
The husband watched his own wife puke without sympathy and left without remorse.
I hate him for this.
My wishes for him have left me confused and troubled, as I am not familiar with this level of dismissive behavior...
.. and I am not accustomed to feeling this level of disappointment in my fellow man.
This is where that 1st Tafée Bowle is going.
I think this is a beautiful place for it to land.
I bought her a 1/8 ounce of G13 to go with it.
I would gladly give up my own food for this fragile girl that is way too sick... way too soon.
I look forward to my appointment tomorrow.
I just wish my eyes would stop leaking and dry up.
ataxian
In a BLACK HOLE!
Kindness s a rare feature these daze?
Vitolo
Vaporist
It has been a week of good vibes and restocking of units to share with my local
patient population.
2 donors, Forum members have altered my # of available units.
I've been sent 3 Tafée Bowles to share. One went today to a young lady that has weighed heavily on my heart.
The encounter was all I dreamed it could be, and I could see she was having fun and considered the education entertaining.
I got a very large socially distant smile, before the mask went back on, and I was grateful
From this same generous soul, I have 2 Hopper IOs to share, along with made to fit Bubblers, and Delta 3D loading stations and filling tools to boot!
Obviously placing the hoppers will require some consideration of just the right patient.
The other donation, also anonymous unless I am given permission to give public thanks....
was a Vaponic (a fancier well thought out Ubie like device- but better),
and 5 WoodScents vapes with wooden stems (and dynavap tips) as well as glass stems.
These vaporizers will go a long way in turning someone's outlook on life around.
Tomorrows patient will get a choice between a Tafe Bowle, and a Da Buddha.
I will look at the physical circumstances when I get there.
Thanks for reading, and stay safe!
patient population.
2 donors, Forum members have altered my # of available units.
I've been sent 3 Tafée Bowles to share. One went today to a young lady that has weighed heavily on my heart.
The encounter was all I dreamed it could be, and I could see she was having fun and considered the education entertaining.
I got a very large socially distant smile, before the mask went back on, and I was grateful
From this same generous soul, I have 2 Hopper IOs to share, along with made to fit Bubblers, and Delta 3D loading stations and filling tools to boot!
Obviously placing the hoppers will require some consideration of just the right patient.
The other donation, also anonymous unless I am given permission to give public thanks....
was a Vaponic (a fancier well thought out Ubie like device- but better),
and 5 WoodScents vapes with wooden stems (and dynavap tips) as well as glass stems.
These vaporizers will go a long way in turning someone's outlook on life around.
Tomorrows patient will get a choice between a Tafe Bowle, and a Da Buddha.
I will look at the physical circumstances when I get there.
Thanks for reading, and stay safe!
Vitolo
Vaporist
Hello Friends,
The patients in Tucson are doing well. Whenever I begin to get close to being low on vapes,
The Universe (and Forum Members), gives me a hand...
I was at the end of battery and glass replacement funds, when a member here made a $65
donation. I wrote a thank you to the email address, but still am not sure who to thank.
Unless I learn Forum name, for now I will just say Thanks, anonymous donor!
Another Forum friend, set us up with a couple of new vapes, which boosted my adrenaline to high level, as I consider placement for a new Mighty, with extra CUs, and capsules! Along with that I received my favorite style of vape to change a patients life.
This was a POTV "One" in color teal.
While I have been taking care of business, gloved, goggled, and masked...
... I have been lucky in not contracting Covid, but I knew how vigilant I have been and felt safe.
Now that I have begun the vaccination process, I am feeling the need for caution, as if you are exposed after 1st Vaccination,
you can't move forward with #2 inoculation.
I get #2 in 2 weeks, and will be fully safe 2 weeks after that.
For this reason, I will attempt to not get close or intermingle until April 11th.
On this date I will have been given Vaccine twice, and have had 2 weeks to
build a full immunity.
If a patient is without, I will see them, but more distanced for the event.
If a Doctor refers a new patient, I will try to gear them toward April 11th....
... but if they sound enthusiastic, I will see them in distanced fashion also.
Thank you anonymous friends of the program.
Thank you all for sending positive energy....
...and Thanks for reading!
The patients in Tucson are doing well. Whenever I begin to get close to being low on vapes,
The Universe (and Forum Members), gives me a hand...
I was at the end of battery and glass replacement funds, when a member here made a $65
donation. I wrote a thank you to the email address, but still am not sure who to thank.
Unless I learn Forum name, for now I will just say Thanks, anonymous donor!
Another Forum friend, set us up with a couple of new vapes, which boosted my adrenaline to high level, as I consider placement for a new Mighty, with extra CUs, and capsules! Along with that I received my favorite style of vape to change a patients life.
This was a POTV "One" in color teal.
While I have been taking care of business, gloved, goggled, and masked...
... I have been lucky in not contracting Covid, but I knew how vigilant I have been and felt safe.
Now that I have begun the vaccination process, I am feeling the need for caution, as if you are exposed after 1st Vaccination,
you can't move forward with #2 inoculation.
I get #2 in 2 weeks, and will be fully safe 2 weeks after that.
For this reason, I will attempt to not get close or intermingle until April 11th.
On this date I will have been given Vaccine twice, and have had 2 weeks to
build a full immunity.
If a patient is without, I will see them, but more distanced for the event.
If a Doctor refers a new patient, I will try to gear them toward April 11th....
... but if they sound enthusiastic, I will see them in distanced fashion also.
Thank you anonymous friends of the program.
Thank you all for sending positive energy....
...and Thanks for reading!
ataxian
In a BLACK HOLE!
My wife and I have not got the shot’s yet!
As soon as it is available well get vaccinated.
Glad you R helping those in need.
Madri-Gal
Well-Known Member
Hi, I need to pick your brain. @Madri-Guy and I are interested in starting a vape program such as yours. M-G started working in Hospice nursing recently, and we see a need.
I was wondering how this works with HIPAA? What's the process patients, doctors and you go through to get everything together? Is there a non-profit that people apply to? In as much as nothing can be done in medicine without records, how do the VA doctors manage to get names out and HIPAA forms and not lose licensing? Obviously, before names can be given of patients, there has to be singed HIPAA forms. How is that dealt with?
It's all about paperwork around here, and in discussing this with the resident hospice nurse, we can't figure out the process, but would like to start helping hospice patients in this area.
We just can't figure out how to get it set up in regards to patient privacy, and doctors not able or willing to go on record when they can't prescribe or recommend medical devices ( i.e. vaporizers) especially related to cannabis, without paperwork and notes to this effect.
M-G has been checking, and it all comes back to records and privacy. It would be great to find out how to get through the paperwork, so more programs can be developed, and more vapes into more hands. M-G can't tell a patient to drink more fluids without writing it down in records, and vapes and cannabis have more effect than water, and lawsuits are always a possibility, especially by families that don't approve of cannabis. In hospice, family members are usually involved and they are upset and grieving over the illness and eventual and pending loss. How are families dealt with?
Are the patients concerned that vaping information will be in medical records? Many patients here want to hide cannabis usage from the hospice nurses, because of fear of judgement by medical personnel, because of insurance, because of privacy, etc. Obviously, doctor's and nurses are bound by law in record keeping and reporting, and these are real issues. Hospitals have requirements as well around records and cannabis. Is there a way facilities Is there information, such as a pamphlet or handout that describes your work?
Is there any oversight? Records of donations, where the vapes and money goes, etc. ? We know there can be audits of non-profits, and if a non-profit isn't involved then it can be regarded as income to those providing vapes. How do you protect yourself and deal with tax issues, so it doesn't look like personal income? Or is a setting up a non-profit the first step?
Thanks for your help. We're excited about becoming advocates, but want to make sure laws aren't broken, and need to convince doctors and nurses that this can, and is being done will no harm to patients, doctors, nurses. It all comes down to paperwork, as much as we'd like to skip it, we know licenses are on the line as well as patient safety, and again, everything done in patient care is done with the knowledge of possible lawsuits. How is the risk minimized?
Oh, you've said you test the vapes before they go out. Is there a sterilization procedure then used before a patient gets the vape? What additional regulations and requirements are in place for the vapes being being used devices? It will help a great deal to know how this works, so we can get a proposal to get to MD's, OD's, PA's, FNP's so they are comfortable recommending patients and participating in the process.
It always comes down to paperwork in medicine, so we figured we would learn from the best and avoid the pitfalls and landmines.
Oh, is there an income requirement? How is that established? What forms or proof of income, what are cut off limits? What happens if a patient can't afford cannabis? Is there help for that? Out here there are some dispensaries that give mmj, but income must be established, and it would be great to get information so we can help get patients what they need by working with those dispensaries.
It just sounds like collecting vapes and passing them out until you start looking into it. Much respect for dealing with these issues for years. You do more than people know. You inspire us.
Last edited:
Vitolo
Vaporist
Firstly.... I went in person in 2009, knowing Medical Marijuana was coming on the ballot in 2010.
I went from Doctor to Doctor giving them my card.
I explained that I was willing to teach patients that they recommended MMJ to...
How to use Medical Marijuana without smoking it.
I discussed my combustion free lifestyle, and I told of this in a very positive light, and discussed also my diminishing need for narcotics
at the hands of a plant. I brought medical records with me so they could see for themselves the extreme gravity of my medical
condition, and who they saw explaining this (me) was cordial, clean, and improving daily from the worst physical damage that many of them had ever seen.
I told them of my personal guidelines, for who I wanted to help. I used my condition and financial status as a guideline.
I told them that I would help patients like myself learn to function as happily and healthily as I function, by teaching them my program of wellness.
The patients to fall into the program (I do make exceptions when the need is serious) had to be:
and assist them with their entry into the use of Medical Marijuana. They take care of whatever paperwork they feel necessary to be in compliance with.
HPIAA paperwork however it feels right to them. They tell me that a patient will be contacting me, and they tell me the name.
I maintain a list of who I have seen and why.
This is a list of friends.
Friends that I gave gifts to that were given as gifts to me.
I am an educator that donates Vaporizers that I have acquired at no cost, to patients very anxious to have these tools.
I am in a position to not care about anyone investigating my finances or life. The most intense scrutiny will uncover nothing other than Vito.
Any money donated ever is permanently documented on a paypal statement. I have receipts since 2009 for all parts bought(glass/batteries)
because I also only purchase using Paypal.
My bank records show clearly an income of $783 a month, and spending it with careful budgeting.
I am 70 years old, and I am chronically and Terminally ill.
I do nothing at all about HIPAA.... I am not giving away personal information about anyone.
I talk with a new patient many times before we meet.
When we do, it is a friend teaching another friend to use Marijuana in a safer more effective way.
I show:
I have worked with patients as young as 4 years old, and as old as 90.
It is a friend giving a gift of a personally owned vaporizer to another friend.
When I test the vapes for function, even though I could "sesh" with it, and sterilize... I don't.
I test it for battery life, Time-out function, heat using a thermal probe.
With tricky vapes like grasshopper, I put a test condom (silicone tip) on the unit. My mouth never touching it.
As a friend visiting another friend I use careful wording that keeps this discussion/relationship from any implication that this is a professional interaction, and can ONLY be interpreted as two patients sharing tools, Medical Mariuana, and techniques.
If I buy something and give it, I do not keep a receipt... It is personal property being given away.
Sometimes I get vapes that are not as much in demand by patients for various reasons.
Those vapes were gifts to me. I am allowed to sell my personal property, and do not need to keep a receipt, because my income is
under the poverty guideline. Under $10,000 a year.
I do not even file taxes.
I get 9,396 a year.
Anyone over 65 does not have to file until they hit $11,950.
That is a large gap!
My motives can be easily established.. I have posted in 2 Vaporizer review forums, 3 Medical Marijuana forums, and 5 grow/Pot user forums.
That is 10 testaments and postings of my activities that have no contradictions.
I limit who can donate or help to 2 forums.
I post what I have done and who I have helped.
The income level verified to me by a Dr. is double checked, by me by asking if they are willing to show me a food stamp card, or an SSI stub.
This is a friend asking another who is wanting a vaporizer if they mind showing me that they are not wealthy.
If they have no documentation, I ask if they are in a tight financial spot. The Doctor already has told me they are on Medicaid.
in 2011, I began visiting the "MMJ Doctors"... those Holistic Providers and MDs strictly in the MMJ area.
I offered to walk in to teach at their offices... and I do that on occasion still.
I did up until 2017 keep a copy of anyone's MMJ card that I donated Marijuana to, to prove compliance (patient to patient aid)
I no longer do this.
The raid that rocked my world in 2015 is also record of what I do, and lack of money... just a list of patients.
The list of all that I have helped, and what I have helped with is still here.
There are over 500 patients to date.
About 70 of these have died.
Now that I have described my process, and how it is accomplished, and answered your questions about my paperwork process, I will share more:
If an individual has an income of over $10,000 year careful records are encouraged.
If a family brings in over $15,000 the same recommendation would apply.... since anyone that takes in more than that much does have to legitimize that the
activities are not an income earning venture.
I started a Forum, for those wanting to Pay it Forward. A site to discuss the steps needed to help fellow patients.
I started the site in 2015, and perhaps I can build upon it's incomplete body.
The site is at: https://payingitforward.activeboard.com
If curious to see where I stopped building anyone here can register (even though incomplete) and see where my thoughts were directed.
I will see the registration, and let you in right away. Message me so I know the email.
PLEASE... I tried hard to address all of the points that you've mentioned, @Madri-Gal.
If in my attempt, I have overlooked or skipped over anything that you wanted a response for... I encourage you to
bring me back on track so that I can try to focus on describing those aspects.
I went from Doctor to Doctor giving them my card.
I explained that I was willing to teach patients that they recommended MMJ to...
How to use Medical Marijuana without smoking it.
I discussed my combustion free lifestyle, and I told of this in a very positive light, and discussed also my diminishing need for narcotics
at the hands of a plant. I brought medical records with me so they could see for themselves the extreme gravity of my medical
condition, and who they saw explaining this (me) was cordial, clean, and improving daily from the worst physical damage that many of them had ever seen.
I told them of my personal guidelines, for who I wanted to help. I used my condition and financial status as a guideline.
I told them that I would help patients like myself learn to function as happily and healthily as I function, by teaching them my program of wellness.
The patients to fall into the program (I do make exceptions when the need is serious) had to be:
- Of Low or no income (verified by Doctor who already knows if they are on aMedicaid)
- Chronically or Terminally ill
- Have a Medical Marijuana card.
and assist them with their entry into the use of Medical Marijuana. They take care of whatever paperwork they feel necessary to be in compliance with.
HPIAA paperwork however it feels right to them. They tell me that a patient will be contacting me, and they tell me the name.
I maintain a list of who I have seen and why.
This is a list of friends.
Friends that I gave gifts to that were given as gifts to me.
I am an educator that donates Vaporizers that I have acquired at no cost, to patients very anxious to have these tools.
I am in a position to not care about anyone investigating my finances or life. The most intense scrutiny will uncover nothing other than Vito.
Any money donated ever is permanently documented on a paypal statement. I have receipts since 2009 for all parts bought(glass/batteries)
because I also only purchase using Paypal.
My bank records show clearly an income of $783 a month, and spending it with careful budgeting.
I am 70 years old, and I am chronically and Terminally ill.
I do nothing at all about HIPAA.... I am not giving away personal information about anyone.
I talk with a new patient many times before we meet.
When we do, it is a friend teaching another friend to use Marijuana in a safer more effective way.
I show:
- tincture making (Alcohol and Glycerin)
- Butter making
- Vaporization
- Reclaim
- Concentrate use
- Cleaning/maintenance
I have worked with patients as young as 4 years old, and as old as 90.
It is a friend giving a gift of a personally owned vaporizer to another friend.
When I test the vapes for function, even though I could "sesh" with it, and sterilize... I don't.
I test it for battery life, Time-out function, heat using a thermal probe.
With tricky vapes like grasshopper, I put a test condom (silicone tip) on the unit. My mouth never touching it.
As a friend visiting another friend I use careful wording that keeps this discussion/relationship from any implication that this is a professional interaction, and can ONLY be interpreted as two patients sharing tools, Medical Mariuana, and techniques.
If I buy something and give it, I do not keep a receipt... It is personal property being given away.
Sometimes I get vapes that are not as much in demand by patients for various reasons.
Those vapes were gifts to me. I am allowed to sell my personal property, and do not need to keep a receipt, because my income is
under the poverty guideline. Under $10,000 a year.
I do not even file taxes.
I get 9,396 a year.
Anyone over 65 does not have to file until they hit $11,950.
That is a large gap!
My motives can be easily established.. I have posted in 2 Vaporizer review forums, 3 Medical Marijuana forums, and 5 grow/Pot user forums.
That is 10 testaments and postings of my activities that have no contradictions.
I limit who can donate or help to 2 forums.
I post what I have done and who I have helped.
The income level verified to me by a Dr. is double checked, by me by asking if they are willing to show me a food stamp card, or an SSI stub.
This is a friend asking another who is wanting a vaporizer if they mind showing me that they are not wealthy.
If they have no documentation, I ask if they are in a tight financial spot. The Doctor already has told me they are on Medicaid.
in 2011, I began visiting the "MMJ Doctors"... those Holistic Providers and MDs strictly in the MMJ area.
I offered to walk in to teach at their offices... and I do that on occasion still.
I did up until 2017 keep a copy of anyone's MMJ card that I donated Marijuana to, to prove compliance (patient to patient aid)
I no longer do this.
The raid that rocked my world in 2015 is also record of what I do, and lack of money... just a list of patients.
The list of all that I have helped, and what I have helped with is still here.
There are over 500 patients to date.
About 70 of these have died.
Now that I have described my process, and how it is accomplished, and answered your questions about my paperwork process, I will share more:
If an individual has an income of over $10,000 year careful records are encouraged.
If a family brings in over $15,000 the same recommendation would apply.... since anyone that takes in more than that much does have to legitimize that the
activities are not an income earning venture.
I started a Forum, for those wanting to Pay it Forward. A site to discuss the steps needed to help fellow patients.
I started the site in 2015, and perhaps I can build upon it's incomplete body.
The site is at: https://payingitforward.activeboard.com
If curious to see where I stopped building anyone here can register (even though incomplete) and see where my thoughts were directed.
I will see the registration, and let you in right away. Message me so I know the email.
PLEASE... I tried hard to address all of the points that you've mentioned, @Madri-Gal.
If in my attempt, I have overlooked or skipped over anything that you wanted a response for... I encourage you to
bring me back on track so that I can try to focus on describing those aspects.
Last edited:
Vitolo
Vaporist
@Madri-Gal
This is a long post.
It's already been a long day.. and it's only 11:25 a.m..
After posting my process earlier, I began thinking about your questions, so I dug deeper.
I got up so early today, and packed my laptop for the road.
I made 2 visits this morning.
The first was to speak to the attorney that went through the investigation into my activities in 2015 with me.
His assistant went over 10.5 years of my paypal records
I was assured that the list of paypal donations Vs. paypal expenses for parts, batteries and glass balanced out for the entire 11 years
He said that they won't go through my bank records again as it cost them a great deal the first time that they "got it wrong".
They also looked at the list on my computer (I printed it out for him) of each patient that I placed vaporizers with.
They were impressed with the records that I kept.
I then visited the Doctor that refers the most patients to me.
She is my Doctor, and does my MMJ card renewal every 2 years
I asked about HIPAA.
She told me that she does nothing about it.
She explained that she is only introducing two patients that might compare situations and help one another.
I showed her your post (I brought laptop).
She said that unless you are planning a National program to acquire vapes across the country that you may
be overthinking what is required to do this.
The attorney said something similar. His comment was that if you are patients trying to help other patients, to go
ahead and keep a list of who you help, and what vape you got for them. Make notes on their individual conditions.
The only HIPAA consideration you must adhere to is never letting other patients see your list.
You don't violate this privacy ever.
I forgot to mention in the post earlier.
When I post pictures of patients receiving or choosing vaporizers, I do get their permission to post those, and I do have them sign a realease
saying "Vito can post this on the Forums he is involved with."
When I have posted Obituaries, or newspaper clippings about the patients that I have lost , I ask the family permission to post the notice for other patients to see.
I do not do it... but in this situation if worried about trouble from the family of someone you have helped.. they can be asked to sign a release too.
It is important to remember that you are taking nothing from the patient.
You are teaching and giving.
The referring Doctor is the witness of how your relationship with the patient began.
I know it's a new era, and people can be nasty.
They can try to "set you up".
My M.D. retired at 90 y.o. 5.5 years ago. He was my Doctor for 40 years.
You did not need an appointment. He would say that's why he had a "Waiting " room.
He made house calls right up until his last day.
He had no computer, but a room full of massive file cabinets and shelves full of files.
By the time I was 65, most of his patients were 65 and older.
He did not carry any extra insurance... just basic.
His belief was that his patients were his family and family would not do wrong to family.
These days there is wrong-doing in families.
When I said I was in a position to not be concerned.....
I am 70 and have serious health concerns.
It would cost a small fortune to incarcerate me.
I have no savings that can be attacked.
I live on a $783 a month, and there is nothing that can be taken from me, except used vaporizers.
They confiscated well over 130 vapes from me after the raid and kept them during the investigation.
The government was forced to return everything taken from me, including money.
The City and State deemed that I was providing a community service.
My age, lack of possessions , my medical condition, my lack of any family in the world..... has freed me
to pay the great debt that I owe the Universe for letting me have these extra years to live.
The only necessity that I am left to afford is gasoline to get around.
Just as my Doctor was a testament to true Hippocratic old fashioned Medical ideals...
In my lack of fear of legal issues or any reprisal, I stand as a bastion to freely teach patients to live and feel at least as comfortably and
well as I do... hopefully they will even live better!
Anyone can do exactly what I do.
It can be easy, or anyone can make it as complex of a model as they wish.
Thanks for reading.
This is a long post.
It's already been a long day.. and it's only 11:25 a.m..
After posting my process earlier, I began thinking about your questions, so I dug deeper.
I got up so early today, and packed my laptop for the road.
I made 2 visits this morning.
The first was to speak to the attorney that went through the investigation into my activities in 2015 with me.
His assistant went over 10.5 years of my paypal records
I was assured that the list of paypal donations Vs. paypal expenses for parts, batteries and glass balanced out for the entire 11 years
He said that they won't go through my bank records again as it cost them a great deal the first time that they "got it wrong".
They also looked at the list on my computer (I printed it out for him) of each patient that I placed vaporizers with.
They were impressed with the records that I kept.
I then visited the Doctor that refers the most patients to me.
She is my Doctor, and does my MMJ card renewal every 2 years
I asked about HIPAA.
She told me that she does nothing about it.
She explained that she is only introducing two patients that might compare situations and help one another.
I showed her your post (I brought laptop).
She said that unless you are planning a National program to acquire vapes across the country that you may
be overthinking what is required to do this.
The attorney said something similar. His comment was that if you are patients trying to help other patients, to go
ahead and keep a list of who you help, and what vape you got for them. Make notes on their individual conditions.
The only HIPAA consideration you must adhere to is never letting other patients see your list.
You don't violate this privacy ever.
I forgot to mention in the post earlier.
When I post pictures of patients receiving or choosing vaporizers, I do get their permission to post those, and I do have them sign a realease
saying "Vito can post this on the Forums he is involved with."
When I have posted Obituaries, or newspaper clippings about the patients that I have lost , I ask the family permission to post the notice for other patients to see.
I do not do it... but in this situation if worried about trouble from the family of someone you have helped.. they can be asked to sign a release too.
It is important to remember that you are taking nothing from the patient.
You are teaching and giving.
The referring Doctor is the witness of how your relationship with the patient began.
I know it's a new era, and people can be nasty.
They can try to "set you up".
My M.D. retired at 90 y.o. 5.5 years ago. He was my Doctor for 40 years.
You did not need an appointment. He would say that's why he had a "Waiting " room.
He made house calls right up until his last day.
He had no computer, but a room full of massive file cabinets and shelves full of files.
By the time I was 65, most of his patients were 65 and older.
He did not carry any extra insurance... just basic.
His belief was that his patients were his family and family would not do wrong to family.
These days there is wrong-doing in families.
When I said I was in a position to not be concerned.....
I am 70 and have serious health concerns.
It would cost a small fortune to incarcerate me.
I have no savings that can be attacked.
I live on a $783 a month, and there is nothing that can be taken from me, except used vaporizers.
They confiscated well over 130 vapes from me after the raid and kept them during the investigation.
The government was forced to return everything taken from me, including money.
The City and State deemed that I was providing a community service.
My age, lack of possessions , my medical condition, my lack of any family in the world..... has freed me
to pay the great debt that I owe the Universe for letting me have these extra years to live.
The only necessity that I am left to afford is gasoline to get around.
Just as my Doctor was a testament to true Hippocratic old fashioned Medical ideals...
In my lack of fear of legal issues or any reprisal, I stand as a bastion to freely teach patients to live and feel at least as comfortably and
well as I do... hopefully they will even live better!
Anyone can do exactly what I do.
It can be easy, or anyone can make it as complex of a model as they wish.
Thanks for reading.
Last edited:
Vitolo
Vaporist
This deserves a new post.
The information that I have given so far has only been from my attorney concerning financial liability, and from a Medical Marijuana Doctor concerning HIPAA and confidentiality. I wrote what she said.
I had placed calls or sent messages to a few referring Doctors, and heard back from an M.D. by email a little while ago.
Now I see where you're coming from about paperwork.
I believe it's location. Written into Arizona's MMJ Laws is P2P... Patient to Patient compassion. Patients are permitted to exchange gifts, trade meds and tools.
As far as this Referring Physician, his documentation goes a bit farther yet is still fairly informal.
I asked in the email:
They arrange to come here as the drive is almost 2 hours, and I shudder to imagine me handling it!
I try to stay close to home.. To help my community here, because I can then be there when they need help.
Vapes break.
In many ways this is still a small town. Informal town.
I mean, I rented the place that I live in now with an unseen German Shepherd, the promise of a Deposit in a week and a handshake...
His promise that accompanied the Handshake was: "I'll give you the lease when you bring the deposit". And he handed me the keys.
The first Medical Clinics (Doc in a Box) Primary Care Offices (Like Iora)and Group Physicians have just started to burgeon here late in this decade.
Doctors had private practices. I've never been able to replace my family Doctor with a private physician... I see a group now!
I am rooting for you to start a program.... it can overwhelm your heart working with some patients. @Madri-Guy knows.. he's been at Hospice.
I have had patients in Hospice care and one is still there.
There are sometimes private homes here that provide rooms, a cook and nursing for a quiet and dignified private experience.
I have one Volcano that has lived in 2 different Hospice settings.
I know it's going to come back some day.....
You never get used to it.
I have a woman lined up for this Volcano now, but they are still not allowing visitors where she lives.. but soon.
The best advice I can give is to start small.
Start with a very manageable cluster.
This will be easy, because things like this build slowly.
When I started I did not have to pay rent... I had a partner, and the house was paid for.
I just paid the taxes and insurance.
I always had funds, and my only expense in life was my Meds.
I would buy a couple of bargain vapes on Classifieds... and I had leftover vapes.. I was a BETA tester.
I collected, and bought every vape I could at great sales I'd find at places like PuffItUp!
Before anyone began to donate vapes to help me, I bought vapes for patients.
I bought and distributed dozens of "Arizona Medical RockZaps". I did not mind giving these freely. I was eating and had free medical care!
Years ago people started sending me used vaporizers when they upgraded.
This helped a whole lot!!
My partnership only lasted for 14 years.
When I left there, I started having to spend over half of my income on rent.
I get food stamps though and don't need much. (Dusty consumes a great amount)
For the past 2 years, All the vaporizers I give are totally donations.
I still maintain the units of the solid state vapes: bags, wands, cords, tubing..
On portables: mouthpieces, batteries, glass, atomizers..
I do the cleaning periodically with those that don't have the dexterity.
I go visit homeless patients to give lighters, hemp wick, butane, MFLBs, VaporGenies replacement ceramic filters,
replacement tops for "Glass Sherlocks"- a personal favorite of mine... at one time I bought a collection of VaporGenies on a classified
Back in the day. I don't buy vapes any more but those were great! They are a favorite among the homeless patients..
and I understand why!
For the last 2 years this has been rewarding... but it's not me doing the buying any more.
Now it's YOU!
I am only the tool that delivers instruction, and service.
The tool that spreads the love of a number of people .. like the forum members here.... into a world
of people that live, some with families on less than $9,000 a year. Quiet a few with nothing.
You can be a tool of this nature easily.
So I have now given the feedback of an M.D., and
shared some about how this started when I was in a $$ position to buy vapes to pay it forward.
@momofthegoons (and many others here) were around back then.
I hope that my past lo-o-ong few posts have encouraged you to think about this.
It feels good.
I'm going to recommend a resource. He's helped me with many of my patients.. some directly when they
are too far for me to drive (people move!), or when parts broke that I could replace.. he was there.
The resource is PuffItUp. His compassion for the Medical Community as a whole is well known.
He started a Free Vapor lounge next door to a Hospital. I wrote about it with a picture here somewhere in our
forum.
He may not participate here on the forum a lot at this time, but a private contact asking his input...
After all he inspired me because he was among the first to sell me used, blemished, and out of-box vapes
to give to the community. He helped me with input about various aspects of supporting a very poor community, as well as
a seriously ill community of patients.
I know these posts are uncharacteristically long for me, but it is not often that someone asks about this...
and I get excited thinking of the beginning....
I get excited imagining this for you.
Thanks for reading!
The information that I have given so far has only been from my attorney concerning financial liability, and from a Medical Marijuana Doctor concerning HIPAA and confidentiality. I wrote what she said.
I had placed calls or sent messages to a few referring Doctors, and heard back from an M.D. by email a little while ago.
Now I see where you're coming from about paperwork.
I believe it's location. Written into Arizona's MMJ Laws is P2P... Patient to Patient compassion. Patients are permitted to exchange gifts, trade meds and tools.
As far as this Referring Physician, his documentation goes a bit farther yet is still fairly informal.
I asked in the email:
The Physician wrote:
Tucson is small. Phoenix is larger, and I have helped patients there also. They have their low income population alright.There may be other criteria in different states, but I handle this with an office visit notation .
On the patient's chart I make note that I recommended vaporization rather than smoking Medical Marijuana. I add that I have referred the patient to
a local community resource that teaches about Herbal Vaporization, and who will provide my patient with a Vaporization Device at no cost, as a Community Service.
I have your card on file.
They arrange to come here as the drive is almost 2 hours, and I shudder to imagine me handling it!
I try to stay close to home.. To help my community here, because I can then be there when they need help.
Vapes break.
In many ways this is still a small town. Informal town.
I mean, I rented the place that I live in now with an unseen German Shepherd, the promise of a Deposit in a week and a handshake...
His promise that accompanied the Handshake was: "I'll give you the lease when you bring the deposit". And he handed me the keys.
The first Medical Clinics (Doc in a Box) Primary Care Offices (Like Iora)and Group Physicians have just started to burgeon here late in this decade.
Doctors had private practices. I've never been able to replace my family Doctor with a private physician... I see a group now!
I am rooting for you to start a program.... it can overwhelm your heart working with some patients. @Madri-Guy knows.. he's been at Hospice.
I have had patients in Hospice care and one is still there.
There are sometimes private homes here that provide rooms, a cook and nursing for a quiet and dignified private experience.
I have one Volcano that has lived in 2 different Hospice settings.
I know it's going to come back some day.....
You never get used to it.
I have a woman lined up for this Volcano now, but they are still not allowing visitors where she lives.. but soon.
The best advice I can give is to start small.
Start with a very manageable cluster.
This will be easy, because things like this build slowly.
When I started I did not have to pay rent... I had a partner, and the house was paid for.
I just paid the taxes and insurance.
I always had funds, and my only expense in life was my Meds.
I would buy a couple of bargain vapes on Classifieds... and I had leftover vapes.. I was a BETA tester.
I collected, and bought every vape I could at great sales I'd find at places like PuffItUp!
Before anyone began to donate vapes to help me, I bought vapes for patients.
I bought and distributed dozens of "Arizona Medical RockZaps". I did not mind giving these freely. I was eating and had free medical care!
Years ago people started sending me used vaporizers when they upgraded.
This helped a whole lot!!
My partnership only lasted for 14 years.
When I left there, I started having to spend over half of my income on rent.
I get food stamps though and don't need much. (Dusty consumes a great amount)
For the past 2 years, All the vaporizers I give are totally donations.
I still maintain the units of the solid state vapes: bags, wands, cords, tubing..
On portables: mouthpieces, batteries, glass, atomizers..
I do the cleaning periodically with those that don't have the dexterity.
I go visit homeless patients to give lighters, hemp wick, butane, MFLBs, VaporGenies replacement ceramic filters,
replacement tops for "Glass Sherlocks"- a personal favorite of mine... at one time I bought a collection of VaporGenies on a classified
Back in the day. I don't buy vapes any more but those were great! They are a favorite among the homeless patients..
and I understand why!
For the last 2 years this has been rewarding... but it's not me doing the buying any more.
Now it's YOU!
I am only the tool that delivers instruction, and service.
The tool that spreads the love of a number of people .. like the forum members here.... into a world
of people that live, some with families on less than $9,000 a year. Quiet a few with nothing.
You can be a tool of this nature easily.
So I have now given the feedback of an M.D., and
shared some about how this started when I was in a $$ position to buy vapes to pay it forward.
@momofthegoons (and many others here) were around back then.
I hope that my past lo-o-ong few posts have encouraged you to think about this.
It feels good.
I'm going to recommend a resource. He's helped me with many of my patients.. some directly when they
are too far for me to drive (people move!), or when parts broke that I could replace.. he was there.
The resource is PuffItUp. His compassion for the Medical Community as a whole is well known.
He started a Free Vapor lounge next door to a Hospital. I wrote about it with a picture here somewhere in our
forum.
He may not participate here on the forum a lot at this time, but a private contact asking his input...
After all he inspired me because he was among the first to sell me used, blemished, and out of-box vapes
to give to the community. He helped me with input about various aspects of supporting a very poor community, as well as
a seriously ill community of patients.
I know these posts are uncharacteristically long for me, but it is not often that someone asks about this...
and I get excited thinking of the beginning....
I get excited imagining this for you.
Thanks for reading!
Last edited:
felvapes
Well-Known Member
That's what she said.......
Madri-Gal
Well-Known Member
@Vitolo, what you wrote is concerning regarding HIPAA. You wrote a great deal, and it will take time to unpack, but your doctor saying she does nothing about HIPAA is alarming. All medical personnel must abide by HIPAA. It's not a choice. You can't violate it. HIPAA is not paperwork you fill out. HIPAA is a Federal Law protecting patients rights, particularly regarding privacy. The VA will be particularly strict, as well as not being able by federal law to recommend MMJ, or medical equipment such as vaporizers for the delivery of cannabis. If you have doctors ignoring HIPAA, you've got a powder keg, and frankly, doctors that shouldn't be practicing.
It sounds like you have a lending program? These aren't gifts outright to patients? Vapes, such as the volcano returned and reused?
How is sanitation handled, particularly with Hospice patients? A Volcano that's been in two sick rooms, and provided support for two deaths would require sterilization. Is there a particular procedure? Having a "lending library " approach seems like it would be an idea due to vape shortages, so the sterilization is important.
Thank you so much for your detailed answers. It helps a great deal to get such wise and sage advice.
It sounds like you have a lending program? These aren't gifts outright to patients? Vapes, such as the volcano returned and reused?
How is sanitation handled, particularly with Hospice patients? A Volcano that's been in two sick rooms, and provided support for two deaths would require sterilization. Is there a particular procedure? Having a "lending library " approach seems like it would be an idea due to vape shortages, so the sterilization is important.
Thank you so much for your detailed answers. It helps a great deal to get such wise and sage advice.
Vitolo
Vaporist
I must correct.
I said that the MMJ Doctor (not the MD.) said that she does nothing about HIPAA when she introduces
2 patients that might help one another.
There is no sharing of names publicly, because there are no names to share.
Simply introductions in a private Holistic Practice. I also, am obviously not a medical practice, and I keep more records than I must.
I rarely deal with the VA here any more, or Veterans with long term concerns more serious than pain, because this VA Doctor in Tucson, gives Ultimatums to his patients... MMJ Card is allowed but MMJ Card = No prescribed pain meds. They must make a choice.
Most vapes are gifts.. to those that can't afford.
I do have a Loaner Library.
So far none have supported a patient that has died of any contagious disease.
Yes to sterilization!
I do not sterilize new units that I buy or others donate... Only used tools.
Volcano as example:
Mouthpiece and bag is thrown away ... Everyone gets their own.
Filter is changed out.
Units are completely dismantled totally cleaned with Iso.
91% Iso is used for all glass interior/exterior.. as well as for the entire outer surface and inner surface of casing and lower plate.
The Heaters are cleaned with 99% Iso (I make less mistakes with moisture near electronics with the 99%)
The units, when done are left in the sun when it's available (It's always out here) to assure o moisture before sealing the bag it will be kept in for next patient.
Portables follow same procedure... mouthpieces are always changed... I keep spares.
The top Cooling Units for the Mighty... I do not just throw out the mouthpiece. I throw out the whole top.
Wooden vapes have fallen out of favor some... but I keep them. If brand new, I sell them to use the $ for parts.
I do keep some though.
Mouthpieces are renewed. Everything that can't be dipped in Iso gets left in the drawer with the UVC light for a week (rotated during that time).
Madri-Gal
Well-Known Member
As the vapes are given to you, free and clear, wouldn't it make more sense to just give the vapes to the patients, and not have to take them apart and rebuild them? I'm not sure of the purpose of giving loaners, especially with issues of sanitation. Is it just terminal patients that have to return to The Lending Library? Or do others participate? How is it determined who gets to keep a new vape, verses who gets used or a loaner? I think of vapes as highly personal items, like an electric toothbrush, so thank you for pointing this aspect if your work out, so I can make sure the vapes we place are gifts to the patients.
You spoke to both a doctor and a lawyer about me wanting to set up a charity for patients, and they said I was "over thinking" for asking questions, and being concerned about HIPAA and patients rights and privacy? How is it possible to be overly concerned about patients, patients rights and HIPAA ? HIPAA is a legal and moral imperative. That seems like an odd response, so I'm going to figure those responses were out of context. Surely asking questions and doing research isn't a bad thing. I don't know what to make of those comments.
Vitolo
Vaporist
I must sanitize them after I test them, unless they are new in a box.
People get used to their vapes, and some have rare or costly ones (A couple of Zephyr Ions out there.. a couple of Volcanos and a few Herbalizers) These patients have become experienced Vaporists, and do not want a different unit, unless I can add to their repertoire... I always try to get them a desktop and a portable.
When their vape goes and I must repair it or send it off, I provide loaners.
I also give loaners when they want to try a new/different unit to see if it fits there needs better.
The object is to make them feel well off, therefore with a higher self-esteem they can flourish!
You are putting words in my mouth by adding your interpretation to what I actually said.
1-I spoke with an attorney that said my financial records were in order, from purchases and donations:
2-I then spoke with my Naturopath (MMJ Doctor):
You asked me some questions, and I gave you some very detailed and very direct answers.
I altered no context, and repeated things as they were said.
The responses were very brief... not much room for altering or adding context.
You make what you will of those comments... I can't interpret them for you.
I do not know that they require interpretation at all, but that is up to you.
I gathered, and remembered all details that I could and addressed all that you've asked.
I think you should create whatever model that feels right to you, and use whatever criteria that feels safe.
I believe that you should create as complex of an arrangement that helps you to feel everyone that you touch is being helped, and is safe.
I believe that you should involve as many agencies as you feel will make this easy and complete for you.
I hope that my responses to your questions, gave you in some way...
...in any way , direction and hope for helping patients that need to feel better.
Another misinterpretation, or maybe you've forgotten what I posted earlier.
I buy vaporizers often. I bought 3 from Puffitup yesterday.
They are not for me, but rather for patients.
They were reduced from 29.99 to 14.99 ... Terp Pens.
Over time there is money left over from my $783 income each month, I buy whatever vapes I see on sale.
After bills are paid, and dog is fed... I buy weed and vapes.
I owe no money, and have no debt.
Your use of the terminology "Free and Clear" suggests that you are thinking of this in terms of monetary value.
All of the tools I collect, trade, buy and repair are of no monetary value in my eyes. The only value the tools achieve
is when a successful match and placement is made.
I understand your caution, and respect your caring.
I wouldn't change the smooth and simple way we function here, or question the success of a model that has a half dozen Doctors, working with
Dispensaries (they refer patients also.. and have me in to speak) choreographing timing with me to see that Patients as bad off as I am or much worse get served.
This includes physically, emotionally, and financially as bad as me and worse.
I teach gardening and budgeting also.... and self defense using canes and walkers (I hold class for seniors in 3 senior centers)
A system that has functioned flawlessly here in this community for 11 years.
(except for that raid on my home and pursuant investigation into my activities and money n 2015...
)It's all good life has it's lessons! (I say now that it's behind me, and the government had to eat crow... I was not so cocky during the raid)
Love to all.
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