Grow First Grow

[sballo]

If you were growing in an inert medium instead of a soil mix measuring becomes easy but in soil you have many variables (even if you make your own recipe) as the soil has nutrients of its own and when you water solids and salts could be making your readings higher after going through your substrate.
I really only ever used my TDS meter in closed-loop NFT, or flood and drain type setups (1400ppm was my sweet spot for my White Rhino but my Incredible Bulk likes nutes a bit weaker, 1200ppm seems OK) where the nutrients are used for a couple of weeks before swapping for fresh.
Hopefully someone with more experience with dirt can chime in and help you.

Wow , there is still a lot I can learn. I have just googled NFT: Nutrient Film Technique. I hadn't known of its existence. I only knew the terminology "soil, coco & Hydroponics" though I actually still know only soil and to be honest this is even the first time that I have used Perlite, which means that even speaking of soil I still don't know everything.

Anyway, from your answer I seem to understand that my considering illogical/hard do comprehend the explanation of that guy on Youtube (see my last posting) is justified. In fact, I thought that his three scenarious as a result of measuring/comparing the value of the feeding water with the one of the run-off water could make sense only if I was using hydroponics.

I would still like to find out a reliable method to measure the ppm thus make sure to monitor the right amount of ppm avoiding both the underfeeding and the overfeeding when growing with soil. Maybe there aren't but it is anyway a learning process. I might opt for hydroponics or NFT for my next grow!?

[That could, by the way, be an other interesting topic to discuss in the future: The advantages/disadvantages/differences of growing with soil, coco, hyproponics and NFT.]

Soil is a great buffer for many things...
Id worry less...
Get temps down..
When experiance comes you will know from your plants if they need more or less nutes..

Yes, it is very exciting learning so much. Believe it or not I am enjoying it , though sometimes I am worried about my three ladies...Well, you have all got it that ......I have no and I am looking forward to

Although the idea of growing your own plants is quite obvious, I had never really considered it. For that, I am very grateful to XX here in this forum for getting me do it.


By the way, today I removed a couple of yellow leaves which appeared to me like a waste of energy for the plant. Ultimately, we all aim at flowers not at leaves, don't we ? But of course I am still not experienced and don't want to do a lot of defoliation yet.


By the way, one of the three ladies (Shoko) seems to be starting flowering already?! Isn't it a tiny bit too fast? The other two also looks moving towards it but they aren't yet.
I cannot consider it as the flowering stage already, can/should I?

 

[Kellya86]

seems to be starting flowering already?!

Yup... thats flowering... this is why i dont like autos....

 

[sballo]

Yup... thats flowering... this is why i dont like autos....

You mean, they are too fast which means that they will not get as huge as photoperiodics? (In my case, as a first grow an because I have nothing to , it is even better if it gets fast)

I have seen on Youtube huge autofowers though.



I wonder how they manged it. It might depend on different factors -apart from growers' experience knowing how to use/do everything properly - it might depend also on the quality of the seeds and so on.

I am wondering why of the three is faster and how I should deal with them (feeding/light).

Anyway, yesterday - I spontaneously decided to give my ladies a nice cut. They showed me pretty clear what were those leaves that could be removed. I followed my instinct. I feel that it was right what I did. Let's see.

Who knows what happens... My three ladies might suddenly explode !

 

[Green Kiwi]

personally ,I would have left every single leaf on the plant.

in Auto, do not trim or touch.

I'am certain that you with your passion and attention, would succeed massively with feminised.....

Auto's well I never got proper(what I aspected)results ,It's way easier and (gives for me anyway more satisfaction,)to keep a mom alive, and in your setup I would have done a sea of green: 12 clones ready in 10 weeks. 2/3 weeks how, then flower till you see they are done.
And than you can trim whatever you like, although depending on the strain....... possibly still totally not needed.....
.
please keep us posted, as I find your adventure very interesting.

 

[sballo]

personally ,I would have left every single leaf on the plant.

in Auto, do not trim or touch.

I'am certain that you with your passion and attention, would succeed massively with feminised.....

Auto's well I never got proper(what I aspected)results ,It's way easier and (gives for me anyway more satisfaction,)to keep a mom alive, and in your setup I would have done a sea of green: 12 clones ready in 10 weeks. 2/3 weeks how, then flower till you see they are done.
And than you can trim whatever you like, although depending on the strain....... possibly still totally not needed.....
.
please keep us posted, as I find your adventure very interesting.

Thank you so much for joining our discussion here in this thread and for expressing your opinion.
You wouldn't have touched any leaf to avoid to stress the autoflowers? I understand what you mean. Though, there are controversial opinions upon whether or not to defoliate (and also topping) autoflowers on the Internet.
As I said, I want to try - with some caution- all those techniques out there to see how the plants react but above all to learn and get better for the future growing.
Yes, I definitely want to try a grow with photoperiodics.
I heard about the "sea of gree" but I still do not know a lot about that. I actually thought that you need a lot of space for that and more than just a single Marshydro 100. I might be totally wrong for you are referring to my setup which is still a bit poor if we consider that I still do not even have a proper grow tent. I will need to conduct a research on the Internet to learn more about the see of green. AS for "clones" I also still know as much as almost nothing about it.

 

[sballo]

Second defoliation....
I am just trying to find my feet with the growing...
Experimenting....
I had the feeling that they reacted well to the first defoliation...
I am trying to determine what are the spots where new flowers will come and leave that area and those leaves untouched...
Let's see how they react to this second defoliation session.

 

[Kellya86]

Second defoliation....
I am just trying to find my feet with the growing...
Experimenting....
I had the feeling that they reacted well to the first defoliation...
I am trying to determine what are the spots where new flowers will come and leave that area and those leaves untouched...
Let's see how they react to this second defoliation session.View attachment 36490

I only really remove fan leafs that the plant has chose to sacrifice... if i can push it down and it falls off, its ready.. if not i leave them for maximum solar panels.. towards thr end of flower i remove more, but not at this stage..

You need to start thinking of somewhere suitable to dry it once harvested..
You can ruin everything if you cock this up..
You must not let it dry to quick.. you will rupture the cellular structure and it will taste and smell absolute shit... like hay..
So really you need a sealed little room that you can control the humidity...
Not trimming is another good way to slow it down.. hang whole plants, leaves and all...

I know this all seems miles away, but you gotta get prepped for this..

 

[sballo]

I only really remove fan leafs that the plant has chose to sacrifice... if i can push it down and it falls off, its ready.. if not i leave them for maximum solar panels.. towards thr end of flower i remove more, but not at this stage..

You need to start thinking of somewhere suitable to dry it once harvested..
You can ruin everything if you cock this up..
You must not let it dry to quick.. you will rupture the cellular structure and it will taste and smell absolute shit... like hay..
So really you need a sealed little room that you can control the humidity...
Not trimming is another good way to slow it down.. hang whole plants, leaves and all...

I know this all seems miles away, but you gotta get prepped for this..

My ladies are looking great after the second defoliation.
I will give them some nutrients this evening. I think they could do with some nutritional help after all this stress.

You took the words out of my mouth indeed. I have started thinking about how to let them try after harvesting them.
In fact, the situation is quite problematic.

1. I really hope I will make it in time with the harvest otherwise it will all be invain because I am flying to Europe for one month in the middle of June
2. Provided that I will make it in time with the harvest before flying, I will be away for a month. I do not know where to let them dry without problems
3. Exactly during the time that I will be away, it will be rainy season in Japan which means that it will be horribly humid here.

I thought I could buy a big storage box in which I could drill two holes and insert sort of apole on which I could hang the flowers (the whole plants?) and put a lot of moisture absorbers like these ones inside:


Amazon product ASIN B006LECOQW
plus a dehumidifier with a container of around 2,5 litres like this one:

Amazon product ASIN B09HH2FH8J

I drew a picture of the idea that I have in mind and attached it here.
And these are my ladies one day after the second defoliation. They seem to look good, don't they?

 

[Hippie]

It's quite "trendy" to use a dehumidifier (with a drainage hole) and a humidity sensor/controller like the Inkbird series ones - and to convert a chiller to put them in, so you can control temp and humidity through the drying and curing process.

If you had a tent - I'd say dry in there
A cardboard box and a small usb fan will do tho ;)

I hope they stretch out a bit more for you as they look quite small and pale to me, altho as I've said, I'm no authority on the autos

 

[Kellya86]

of June

Dude thats cutting waaayyy to close...

You need to be there to monitor humidity.. you could, and probably will come back to overdry weed if you gone for a month..

Maybe id think of freezing it fresh and using it all for extraction...

I hope they stretch out a bit more for you

Its not looking promising.. shouldnt of trained autos..
If all goes well i think hes looking at 7gs per plant.. maybe an oz all together..

 

[sballo]

Hello guys and always thank you very much for your support and feedback. It is very appreciated.
Yes, It might be that I have stressed them a bit too much with defoliation etc..

I have been learning a lot through my experimenting, the feeback/comments/recommendations that I kindly receive from you and from how the plants react. I consider this very valuable for me.


In Tokyo starting from June it is going to be the rainy season which means a lot of humidity. That is why I doubt, that there is the risk that the weed will be overdry when I come back.
What is the right humidity level to let them dry but then keep healthy - without running the risk that they will overdry- ?

What do you think of my idea (see pictures of my last posting), Couldn't it work well?


Another thing I am really wondering is why one of the plant looks to be in the flowering stage (Or is that the so called "preflowering" stage? - please see attached pic) already but the other two still not and whether I need to treat them differently speaking of nutrients (maybe the faster one need to be feeded for the flowering stage already?) and of lights (In the flowering stage it should be ideal to have a 12/12 light-darkness?!)

 

[Kellya86]

overdry when I come back

Works both ways my friend.. could come back to mould... thats even worse... your product will then be unusable...

You wanna start with high humidity and graduallly bring it down over 10 days... so at first you will likely be in the 80s...
Get it down to 60s...
Then think about jars and burping... make sure you got mini hygrometers to go in jar...

Your setup for drying is ok, jus doing it blind is an unknown for me..

In flower its 12/12 yes...

The other 2 will catch up... are they different strains ???

 

[sballo]

Works both ways my friend.. could come back to mould... thats even worse... your product will then be unusable...

You wanna start with high humidity and graduallly bring it down over 10 days... so at first you will likely be in the 80s...
Get it down to 60s...
Then think about jars and burping... make sure you got mini hygrometers to go in jar...

Your setup for drying is ok, jus doing it blind is an unknown for me..

In flower its 12/12 yes...

The other 2 will catch up... are they different strains ???

Thank you for your explanation. In fact, I read a similar procedure on the internet (10 days....then jars etc..) but as I said, I will definitely not be at home for a month, unfortunately. I am flying the middle of June to Europe. Until then I doubt that the process of harvesting and drying is over already that is why I am looking for a solution and I came up with that setup.

Yes, flowering stage is 12/12 but has my plant reached the flowering stage already or is that still the pre-flowering stage?

No, they are all the same strain 00 Kush auto, that is why I am wondering why one of them is faster.

 

[Kellya86]

No, they are all the same strain 00 Kush auto, that is why I am wondering why one of them is faster

Not all of the same seeds are the same.. this is how you get phenos..

If i were you.. id seriously jus freeze it till you get home...

 

[Hippie]

You want to aim for the low 60s to prevent mould growth.

I thought autos don't need 12/12 and you carry on with the 18/6 or 20/4 or 24hr constant light throughout the grow.
I would carry on with the grow/veg feed for 2 weeks from the start of the flowers (about 10 days now) then switch to bloom/flower feed. Switching to the bloom feed too early can lead to extra stretching tho so you may want to encourage that by switching earlier as they haven't stretched much (and Kush plants don't stretch much anyway)

They're sisters so they're not going to be identical - you may have different phenotypes but the difference is probably because you've treated them differently in my opinion

 

[sballo]

Not all of the same seeds are the same.. this is how you get phenos..

If i were you.. id seriously jus freeze it till you get home...

It makes totally sense to me. They are not cloned indeed. They are sisters belonging to the same family.
I just thought that the would all behave the same because they are auto..

It sounds comprehensible and safer to freeze it but I will have then to deal with extraction..It is all going to be too much for me right from the beginning.
I still don't even have a proper vaporiser for that.
I think I will give it a try with my idea.

You want to aim for the low 60s to prevent mould growth.

I thought autos don't need 12/12 and you carry on with the 18/6 or 20/4 or 24hr constant light throughout the grow.
I would carry on with the grow/veg feed for 2 weeks from the start of the flowers (about 10 days now) then switch to bloom/flower feed. Switching to the bloom feed too early can lead to extra stretching tho so you may want to encourage that by switching earlier as they haven't stretched much (and Kush plants don't stretch much anyway)

They're sisters so they're not going to be identical - you may have different phenotypes but the difference is probably because you've treated them differently in my opinion

There are controversial opinions on that and this makes everything more confusing. Some assert that also autos need 12/12 in the flowering stage, other are of the opposite opinion. I will try to read more at depth on the internet about this question.

Thank you for your suggestion with the feeding. You mean that switching to the blood feed can lead to extra stretching? It sounds like something that my little ladies could do with but I honestly thought that actually the grow/veg feed is more meant for growing and stretching rather than the bloom feed.
I don't know.. I will give all of them the pre-flowering feed

This brings me to the next point which I am still trying to understand. I still haven't understood whether the first lady is in the pre-flowering stage or in the flowering-stage.

I might as well consider her as in the pre-flowering stage for another week.

 

[Hippie]

For me that's flowering
My favourite time when the pistils start forming crowns like that

Aaand my opinion on the light cycle is that 18/6 will give them 50% more light than 12/12 which means they get 50% more energy every day to turn into the good stuff. Given that it makes no difference to the plant and won't turn an autoflower hermaphrodite it sounds like it could be a real advantage for the autos and we could see much higher cannabinoid and terpene contents from the autos in the future, with the lights on for longer.

 

[sballo]

For me that's flowering
My favourite time when the pistils start forming crowns like that

Aaand my opinion on the light cycle is that 18/6 will give them 50% more light than 12/12 which means they get 50% more energy every day to turn into the good stuff. Given that it makes no difference to the plant and won't turn an autoflower hermaphrodite it sounds like it could be a real advantage for the autos and we could see much higher cannabinoid and terpene contents from the autos in the future, with the lights on for longer.

For me that looks also much like flowering, indeed.
Thank you for your response.

As for the light cycle, I might do the way you suggested: 18/6 but I am still not sure.. As you said, you don't have experience with autos though.
In fact I was asking myself how I could give the flowering one more sleep time.......was considering putting it into a cupboard.....
You know what?? I will go for 18/6. After reading a bit here and there on the internet, I think that your suggestion is the right one.

As for the nutrients:
you said that you would wait a bit longer before starting with the bloom/flower feed in order to let the plant stretch a bit more, right?
If so, I would then do the same with the other two....(They are really much slower than their sister)

 

[Hippie]

Normally, for photoperiod plants I'd say wait for 2 weeks after switching the light to the flower cycle before changing over to bloom feed.
Switching to bloom feed too early can lead to extra stretching tho so I think I'd start feeding with bloom feed now, which will actually mean that in the pot there will be a mix of both feeds for the next few waterings anyways (resulting in the 3:2:1 to 1:1:1 to 1:2:3 ratios of feed in the pot that I mentioned waay back in the thread)

 

[sballo]

Speaking of ppm, what would be the right amount of ppm for autos in the pre-flowering and flowering stage, when growing with soil?
I thought that something around 600- 700 would be ideal but I might be wrong.

Anyway, one of the three has a water runoff of around 650 but the other two of only around 460 although I have been feeding them.
I am wondering if I should give them more nutrients or whether we can't rely on the ppm level.